Ottawa Fiero Club Forum

Pulled apart the front brakes on the weekend. I'm thinking of doing an upgrade, since I would like to do some autox this summer. Not big on the corvette brakes due to cost and I don't like the idea of having a second set of holes on the rotors. I've got an idea of a variation of the lebaron upgrade that might work well that Im still researching.

We definitely like the "lebarons" on our 85, and they're only installed on the front at the moment.  Never had a chance to stress test them on a track or auto-x course before parking the car, but for day-to-day driving they have a good amount of bite to them. 

I'd definitely recommend adding Aaron's combination valve modification or an adjustable proportioning valve to your set-up.  Being able to fine tune the front/rear balance has significant advantages over relying upon the 25 year old guts of a combination valve which wasn't designed for your parts combination in the first place.

The 88 style Grand Am brakes are a nice improvement over stock and very reasonable price wise.
No matter which route you go you will most likely need to have your front rotors machined down to just the hubs so I would start asking around machine shops to see if one will do the job as a lot of shops will not do it for safety reasons as they say. Dan

Yes I was planning on adding a proportioning valve for sure so I can fine tune them.

I'm a machinist so making the rotors into hubs is not a problem, finding the time to do it on the otherhand is!   ;)

I found some time here's where I'm at:

Hubs:

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4038/4376750554_d87f3b5788_b.jpg)

11.5" Rotor:

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4071/4376004137_0a38e53244_b.jpg)

Test fit behind the wheel I will be using (needs new paint)

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2719/4376752626_8050b7c62b_b.jpg)

Next I'll be looking into calipers and making brackets.

Clearance problems come more from the calipers that are moved out ward to fit the larger rotor not the rotor itself. Dan

Oh ya for sure! Just wanted to see what it would look like.

First mock up with the caliper

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4001/4439749262_3c081080b0_b.jpg)

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2740/4439748568_b2333b2f85_b.jpg)

Not bad for a first try, caliper needs to move closer in.

Got the caliper mounted today and it fit perfect. Then I turned the wheels. Crap, it hits the shock before lock with the suspension under full droop. I guess I'll try a different caliper, that one was a bit large anyways.

Move the shock.  It'll be less work.

Ya I was looking at doing that. I don't see how it will be less work though. The brackets I made are just mock up's out of plywood.

Getting back on this project. I got some new calipers yesterday and will be working on this over the next little while.

Well where has the time gone? Spring is coming and I want to drive my car this year so I'd better get cracking. I've almost finished the first side. Then doing the other side will be easy.

Teaser pic

(http://i.imgur.com/ADXbS.jpg)

Over the last year I've invested almost $15,000.00 into my car trying to make it road worthy from sitting in my garage the last 20 yrs or so untouched!!!  From A to Z had to be replaced on the brake system.  I was given many options, prices, and opinions from the shop doing the work (The Fiero Factory in Toney, Alabama) and the end result was all stock brakes!!  The only problem I ever encountered in the past was the front locking up on the race track under very hard braking.  I came to the conclusion that it wasn't due to poor brakes but lack of traction/weight in the front!!  My solution was.......an this may sound real silly to a lot of you, I had my spare tire filled with calcium which added about 100lbs over the front wheels and a softer compound to the front tires and it was amazing!!!! The cost was almost nothing, no headaches, no modifications!!!!  I'll bet my stock Fiero brakes perform as well as any of the newer solutions!!!  The only down side to my solution was getting the spare tire out once when it was required!!!  The extra weight was never an issue due to the V-8...............

Putting more weight on the front end is a way to do it, but I don't like the idea of adding weight to the Fiero since it's already a little on the heavy side. I'm planning moving the battery up front when I do my 3800 swap which is going to help. Also there is a lot you can do with the suspension to transfer more weight to the front end. The biggest problem with the stock brakes is the rotors are small and thin and do not cool very well. I'm going to weigh the stock components and compare them to the new ones and see what the difference is. I think it will be perty close.

my main motivation in "up grading" to grand am brakes/jimmy master/booster is mainly due to the cost.  from summit I can order everything from the booster to the pads for under 300$ plus shipping(using a u.s. addy), there is no way I could do this with stock parts.

I looked at all the comparisons while my car was at the Fiero factory and decided to keep them stock based on the owner of the shop telling me often they saw little to no improvements in braking no matter how modified the brakes where.  I never had a problem in the past.....so stock I went and saved big bucks doing so.  I wouldn't mind a ride in a car with modified brakes to see how better it could actually be...if anything!!!

well i'll be ordering the parts up this week, ill be adding a line lock and using the stock proportioning valve, should have it done well before the last of the snow melts around my place.

as it stands, I get one hard brake before they fail and I pull a fred flintstone to slow down, so no matter what the brakes have to get done before I hit the roads

Brakes are a big issue with most people, but not for the obvious reasons.  The number one question you have to ask yourself is what kind of braking do I need to do?

Maximum deceleration will be a factor of combined inch-friction/weight between the tire and the road (not the brake pads to the rotor).  Your limitations are set by the tire (corner) with the lowest ration, not the highest.

Your first consideration should be correcting the front to rear braking bias.  The Fiero has very restricted rear braking.

Your second consideration is to correct the left to right weight bias.  No addition of weight is required for this operation, just clever engineering.

Your third consideration is to replace the brake booster (upgrade it).  How fast the booster engages makes a huge difference in stopping distance.

After this your options are quite application specific.

Increase your tire to road friction coefficient (this means sticky tires).  "Cons" to this modification are cost.  Not just for the tire but the fact that they will wear much faster (thereby adding more cost).

Using brake pads with higher friction coefficients.  You can get pads with as much as four times the friction.  These pads wear fast and bite hard (you touch the brakes and your thrown into your seatbelt).

Rotors:  How much heat do you need to dissipate.  Are you doing Solo II, Solo I, Lapping Days?  Do you want your car just to look awesome?

And or course the obvious maintanance cost.  Fiero parts are getting expensive, and other than the cost of the mod, mod's can be cheaper to maintain.

The right combination of modification for your application can be quite specific.  Don't be shy I can answer questions.  But to supply all the information in this post would require many pages of writing.

I put the stock parts on the scale and compared them with the new set up and it looks like the new set up will add 4 pounds per side. Stock was 22 pounds the new set up is 25.8. Not too bad I don't think for a bigger rotor and four piston calipers. I'll have to weigh the stock wheel and compare it to the new ones also.