Front End Woes

[danthefieroman]

Hey all,  I have an '84 Fiero SE 2M4 - all stock with 114,000 klicks on it.

I've had a nagging front end/steering problem for the longest time and I'm hoping that with all of your combined experience with Fieros, you may have encountered the same thing along the way.

The symptoms are that although the car drives straight without pulling in any direction, whenever I change lanes, or drive over a crown in the road, the wheels want to pull the car over in that direction on its own accord.  This lends to a feeling of instability at the wheel and uncertainty over which direction the car is going to waver off to with the next bump in the road.

I thought initially that it was an alignment problem which does seem to cure the problem temporarily (that is when a 4 wheel alignment is performed, the steering is tight and there is no "wandering" on the road), however, after 2 to 3 days, the symptoms reappear and I'm right back where I started from.

I have voiced my concerns to the GM dealership before and after the alignment and had them check out the front end. They have found nothing in the process.

I have even taken the car to Crappy Tire (Big Mistake) and their diagnosis was to change the steering rack as they said that they found "play" in the original one. They even swapped out the "damping" shock that sits along the front axle axis between the tires.

After many $$$$ parted with later, the problem soon reared it's ugly head again and I'm right back at square one.

So before I sink any more Samolians into my beloved Fiero, I would like to get some input from fellow Fiero owners on what you think some potential causes could be to my dilemma.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Dan.

[fiero308]

hi Dan
I am pretty much an amateur from the "length-of-ownership" point of view, but an idea for you is to make sure the REAR end is properly aligned. It has come under a LOT of fire and criticism about causing a very pronounced bump steer effect to the extent that is is singled out as the worst handling problem area of the 84-87 fieros.  I expect GM would have done that if they did an alignment for you but it is worth being REALLY sure.
It does sound like some sort of 'toe-out' problem, tho.
Steering rack play isn't a bad thought either; is it in good shape now?
my two cents.
gp

[FieroDough]

bup steer or improper camber.

Check bushings, don't relly need poly, just make sure they are good and not rotted out.

Improper camber makes the car twitchy and darty as well. (hard to adjust on a fiero)

cheers!
Eric

[danthefieroman]

GP...that's pretty good advice with regards to the bump steer effect from the rear end.  I've been noticing that the rear struts are getting kinda soft and now I'm wondering if the bushings there are in dubious condition.

I was debating whether to get the struts changed and now there seems to be a compelling reason to do so. At the same time, I'll have them perform a 4-wheel alignment to ensure the camber (Thanks Eric!!) and toe-out is adjusted to spec and the bushings checked on the front end at the same time.

Thanks again! Cheers!

[Fieroflyer]

I had one years ago that wandered once in a while but everything always checked out ok when inspected, even alignment shop couldn't find it. Ended up being the rear cradle bushings were shot allowing the rear to move slightly once in a while when road conditions were not exactly perfect throwing off the alingment temporarily. Unfortunately alignment shops can't simulate bumps and ruts in the road. Dan

[ddroger]

You say "all stock", but I have to ask if the wheels are stock Fiero wheels with recommended-size tires. Wheels with incorrect offset (sticking too far out) can cause some of what you're experiencing,even if alignment was correct.

Don

[x-thumpr-x]

Another part you might want to check out is your rear toe-link rods (tie rod). I had one start to go on me and every now and then when I made a right hand turn, it felt like I had 4 wheel steering and the car found any groove on the highway to follow.

[fiero308]

after re-reading, it sounds like GM looked at the front end only? Is that right?  The rear end is actually a front end too, in more than one way.  You have the alignement issues of the McPherson strut settings (oh yeah, any chance they are worn out?) as well as the tie rods that introduce rear-end bump steer AND you have ball joints that cost in the $90 range if I remember rightly, meaning they might NOT have been changed as frequently as they should.........
and either one could cause very very noticable wandering. Check out Pennock's - there are a few guys who autocross and race and they have no use for the 84-87 rear end simply because of that.  Helm's (I think? ) has rear bump steer correction kit that eliminates the tie rod connection to the car frame - a good idea since it serves no useful purpose - AND eliminates the ball joint altho it must replace it with something else that is equivalent.
lots to think about......
If you go and get more things checked, maybe you could update everyone so that we all benefit here.  That makes this all worthwhile. Good luck!

Sorry; it was Held's, NOT Helm's (old age strikes again!) that I was referring too.  I KNEW it was wrong when I typed it!

[GoFast85]

For bump steer fix check out: http://www.heldmotorsports.com/bump.htm

[danthefieroman]

Wow.....you guys are good!  I was expecting one or two replies to my post and not the wealth of knowledge I'm getting here!

Certainly lots to think about. I would never have thought to approach the problem from the rear end as indicated by reference to the "bump-steer" effect

By the way Don, (ddroger) the wheels are original stock Fiero wheels with P21560R14 GoodYear Eagle GTs all around.

I will definitely keep you guys up to date on what I found out so we can add it to our "Knowledge Base".

(The Held's bump-steer correction kit is enticing.......!!!!)

Thanks again to everyone for all your time!

[JetJumper]

I have an 84 fiero...took it out yesterday for a test drive...and when ever I hit bumps....it does that woeing stuff... Haven't looked into mine yet, but I will today.  (Millage is only 105,000)

[Fieroflyer]

Come on now Chris we all know 4 bangers can't go fast enough to be a problem. Hee Hee. Dan

[JetJumper]

dammit, your so right too

Well...It still does that crap...I will look at the bearrings (Can't spell:P) first.